Stock performance upgrade salt?

> Get cheap low mile 2 door tuner car
> See many affordable ways to add Performance/HP
> Go to car forums for opinions
> See non-stop salty remarks to whomever is seeking any sort of performance advice on stock cars
> "Why didn't you buy the performance x-version of car ($10k more) or find used one (still $6k more)

Help me understand why people are like this?
Say >person< with limited income comes into good condition low-end performance car.
Wants to spend $1-2k on upgrades and people make tons on personal and financial attacks on said person.
I've seen this same attitude on Motorcycle & Bicycle forums as well.

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  1. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >already bought used
    >bought something slow and gay
    >wants to make it less slow and gay
    >others rightfully point out you should have just started with something faster
    This is an extremely weird cope thread.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      That's cool, I'm ok with coping. I just wanna know why I live rent free in you're head?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        >I just wanna know why I live rent free in you're head?
        Same reason you brought a cheap car. You can't afford anything better.

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Anon, if you want to be a moron and polish a turd that's up to you. But don't expect people not to opine about it. If you weren't questioning your decision these imaginary peoples fictitious opinions wouldn't bother you so. So who's living rent free in who's head?

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        Because anything you want to do there's a whole company who made the car with billions of dollars and a team of 100s of engineers who already tried it, tested it, and decided it's worth or not worth doing

        There's next to no "affordable ways to add performance/HP" that can outweigh selling it and paying the extra $2-5000 for the faster one with the only real exception being exhaust/tunes on turbo cars and cams on pushrod V8s

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          youre dumber than op lmao

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          >There's next to no "affordable ways to add performance/HP

          look at dis homie
          never heard of an Ebay turbo lamo

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          BMW B58 Stage one is like an extra 70Hp on stock engine.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah that's

            >real exception being exhaust/tunes on turbo cars

            And even then a used G80 M3 is already hitting low 60s

            https://i.imgur.com/nZm6Cf2.jpeg

            >There's next to no "affordable ways to add performance/HP

            look at dis homie
            never heard of an Ebay turbo lamo

            have you ever done a eBay turbo

            it's never just the turbo and that's assuming you don't shit a rod/vent the block

            youre dumber than op lmao

            post build and I can tell you what you could've bought for what you spent that would rape your shit

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >have you ever done a eBay turbo
            Yes, just don't get greedy and keep the boost low.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Then your injector gets stuck open or you get a bad tank of gas and it blows up, or your clutch/auto trans originally meant for maybe 50hp over stock starts slipping.

            "eBay turbos" only work when the tuning labor fabrication is free and it's a overbuilt brick shithouse of a engine (most of which are in cars that aren't cheap anymore like ka24s in 240sxs and obd1 2jzges) and even then they die spontaneous death

            the 3vzfe in the 3rd gen camry can get about 10 free hp by simply advancing the timing to 17 degrees btdc (14 if you get pinging), and leaning out the very rich factory fuel mix by turning the cog inside the air flow meter clockwise a few clicks.
            the stock front exhaust coming from each bank connects via an incredibly awful, inefficient T-junction that has a baffle in it that restricts flow even further. getting a proper Y-pipe results in a small but noticeable increase in mid-range power.

            And now you're running premium in a Camry

            Only the chassis of a car matters. everything else can be upgraded or replaced. Especially with older cars, it's easier said than done to "just buy a better version". Most people making these replies just want to hear themselves speak.

            Kinda realized that when I spent a lot of money using a 5 year old F80 M3 as a benchmark...only to be slightly faster than a stock one with a lot more compromises

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Then your injector gets stuck open or you get a bad tank of gas and it blows up

            Look there he is! It's the car forum boomer!
            >"you can't turbo your car because your injector will get stuck open or you'll get a bad batch of fuel!!!!"
            Why even own a car then? That could happen to any of them.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >And now you're running premium in a Camry
            nope, doesn't ping or det with regular.
            >implying late model v6 camrys don't use premium already

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Turbo
            >Low boost
            What the fricking point then? Just go with a supercharger for ease of install/maintenance and desired power level

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Because superchargers cost 10 gorillion dollars, aren't that easy to mount, and draw half as much power as they boost.
            >what's the point
            There he is again! "what's the point of adding a noticeable amount of power to your car, you need to give it a gorillion extra horsepower or none at all"

            From forums, to facebook, to DA, car people are always the same.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            That's not what he's saying. He's asking what the point is of installing a turbo that your car can't use 90% of the potential of when you could get a supercharger instead or, alternatively, buy a faster car that can use the turbo you want to put on.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >what's the point
            MORE POWER moron
            >b-b-b-b-b-but it should be more more power
            more more power might be better, but MORE POWER IS STILL GOOD

            Fricking car people.....

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You're missing the point dumbfrick.
            >adding a turbo, intake, manifold, (potentially) cooler, (potentially) high-flow fuel setup, all the other shit you need in order to actually be able to PHYSICALLY PUT THE TURBO IN YOUR CAR AND HAVE IT DO SOMETHING
            >can't even use it after spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars
            Buy a different fricking car, IDIOT. Maybe you'll even be able to turbocharge that one properly. If you think that turboing a car is just shoving a funny little snail fan onto your air intake then you're either going to get ZERO POWER or you don't know how turboing works and I look forward to watching your engine explode on youtube.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >can't even use it
            >going to get ZERO POWER

            Alright I take it back, DA is even worse than the car forum boomers and facebook Black folk.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Do it homosexual. Bolt a turbo onto your shitbox without any of the things I mentioned. Film the results.

            I'll be looking forward to watching you cry about it.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I can go outside right now and take my car for a drive and feel the extra power of that turbo I added while morons like you screech about how it won't work or it will blow up or it was a waste of time.
            That's what's so hilarious about reading all your moronation.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Uh huh. Post your engine bay. Either you have a full setup in which case you are a BULLSHITTER that knows what I was saying was true, or you won't post in which case you are a LIAR that doesn't know anything about what was being discussed.

            Neither outcome looks good for you. I'll wait.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Well of course I have a fricking cheap intercooler too moron
            >"can't even use it"

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >"well of course I bought more than just a turbo"
            WHOOPS! He's moronic.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You gunna pretend the phrase "Ebay turbo" means you literally just get a turbo and nothing else? That's fine I don't mind if you play semantics to save face.

            But why did you say:
            >"can't even use it after spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars"
            ??

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            No, that's what you frickups are implying by saying that an ebay turbo is "a cheap performance mod." That's hundreds of dollars that could go towards a better car.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            but why did you say I can't even use it after spending that hundreds of dollars?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >But why did you say:
            >>"can't even use it after spending hundreds if not thousands of dollars"
            >??
            Maybe if you think hard enough about these posts

            >have you ever done a eBay turbo
            Yes, just don't get greedy and keep the boost low.

            >Turbo
            >Low boost
            What the fricking point then? Just go with a supercharger for ease of install/maintenance and desired power level

            you'll figure it out.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            and that's why you're another car forum boomer moron, you have to exaggerate that I "can't even use it" it to try to prove your moronic point

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah it's almost as if spending money on a setup that TAKES YOU TIME TO BUILD that you CANNOT USE THE FULL POTENTIAL OF when you could have spent that same money on a car with MORE POWER THAN YOUR SETUP is, in fact, fundamentally moronic.

            Keep coping re. (You)r Shitbox. I'm out.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Oh so now it's "cannot use the FULL potential of"?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I don't have a build I drove shit boxes I got for free my whole life to save up for a house with a shop. however my older brother ls swapped his 94 mustang for basically free save some hardware here and there and the roll bar. only thing I really know about it is it's got he same cam his work runs in the copo camaros they race (how he got most of his ls stuff free). he did favors for the k member and some control arms and other odds and ends he's got a street legal full interior car that runs 10s for basically the 2 grand he bought the car for 10 years ago which almost doesn't even count cause it was his daily driver most of that time.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >the affordable way to add HP is to get a bunch of expensive mods for free
            Checks out.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            there's dozens of free modifications that can be done for the cost of a die grinder and bits. from the intake to the (if equipped) turbo and everything in between. remember those constraints I mention here

            [...]
            Also that's not why I called you dumb actually it was the statement about engineers designing it so there's no improvements to be made. those same engineers would tell you that's no true. they have a lot of constraints they have to work within that Joe blow doesn't

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >there's dozens of free modifications that can be done for the cost of a die grinder and bits.
            Name them.

            >from the intake to the (if equipped) turbo and everything in between.
            Turbos aren't free and in the case of some engines and drivetrains require substantial modification to properly use. Similarly, a new intake is going to do jack shit for power unless the rest of the engine is set up to capitalize on cold or ram air.

            What car is it anon?

            Also to be clear, a lot of forums do get those kinds of questions very often. You'd be surprised how many people hear about how they can build up an engine to make giga-HP "with a few simple mods" and go to forums asking about it only for at-length discussions to be had about why for a lot of engines this simply isn't true. Even when it comes to something as common as adding forced induction to an engine you sometimes have to do more than just slap the turbo on there and zoom off. You have to prep the engine if it isn't an engine already made to handle FI, which can involve swapping out a lot of internal parts and, depending on how much boost you're adding, may require you to tear down the entire engine and replace important sealant and rotating assembly components, to say nothing of the expense of forged internals depending on the amount of extra pressure you're expecting to add.

            At that point you're not doing "a few simple mods." You're doing a rebuild. And if you're doing a rebuild, then the obvious question must be asked: why are you doing a $5-10k operation on a shitbox when you could have put that extra $5-10k towards a car that has already had all of this done professionally and properly? You might say "sure I can swap the headers for less money" or "but what if I add high-flow DFI," and the answer is going to be that outside of a few engines/setups for which this is a significant gain, the amount of HP you'll get from that level of modding will generally be somewhat negligible, since the power gained from those mods scales with how much power has already been squeezed out of the other components of the engine. Swapping the headers on a high-end V6/V8 with heavy compression and high internal volume/piston travel? Great. Adding high-flow DFI to an engine with a properly-tuned high-volume FI system and a rotating assembly that can handle the extra power? Excellent. Doing these things without the essentials in place? Pointless.

            Even assuming that you do the absolute bottom-of-the-barrel build here, there's no point in spending the couple hundred dollars you'd need for a cheap turbo/intake setup when that same couple hundred dollars can get you a car with more HP naturally when you're dealing on the shitbox level.
            >"why modify any car then when you can just buy a better one???"
            There comes a point where cars exponentially balloon in costs and performance modifications then become cheaper. This is the point where you should be modding, unless you just really really really like your shitbox and want to make Your Car Specifically a performance monster to the best of its ability, but this isn't what the OP was talking about.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            moron from intake to turbo I was naming them. port and polish. turbo if equipped. lots of cars come with turbos these days lets say for example anon has an eco boost mustang, that's got a turbo this is not optimized. idk wtf all this rambling is abou
            >Similarly, a new intake is going to do jack shit for power unless the rest of the engine is set up to capitalize on cold or ram air
            as its total nonsense .you wouldn't have to do anything else if again let's say anon has an ecoboost mustang. the computer will compensate for a port and polish or for cold air. believe it or not, the computer knows what to do with freezing cold air, the engineers thought they'd like to sell the car in more places that get cold

            you can port and polish the heads, you can grind weight off connecting rods, the list of shit is huge you're just a wrenchlet .

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >well you see if anon has a decent car then he'll be able to make power with mods!
            This is LITERALLY what everyone is saying, I'm not sure why this is so hard to understand. You're assuming that by "cheap low mile 2 door tuner car" he actually means "a car set up for a wide range of performance mods" and if that was the case then this thread wouldn't even exist.

            You're agreeing with people who were saying what you were saying before you were even saying it while calling them morons and offering completely irrelevant examples.

            You also refused to post your build, so I'm going to assume that (You) are the wrenchlet here instead.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >decent car
            wrong it's not the v8. Anyway you're moving goal posts those modifications could be made to a civic and will produce a more powerful civic. could be done to your tractor ffs and will produce a more powerful tractor.
            Anyway like I said I don't really have a build. I have a project car I know basically nothing about yet because I've only recently decided I could afford it and have a shop now from saving up driving free cars and a project bronco that's totally stock I've just been repairing rust damage on. (also one of those free vehicles I used to make money plowing to again save money for my house and shop)
            that said me being the one who's proven you completely ignorant of how to make horsepower it's irrelevant also what you think about my wrenching ability

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >that said me being the one who's proven you completely ignorant of how to make horsepower it's irrelevant also what you think about my wrenching ability
            Listen anon, I'm trying to be patient with you but if you're going to be a bastard about it then we're going to have a bad time here. You're completely missing the point as proven by:
            > Anyway you're moving goal posts those modifications could be made to a civic and will produce a more powerful civic. could be done to your tractor ffs and will produce a more powerful tractor.
            The entire point of the critique that the OP is mad about is that THE TIME AND MONETARY INVESTMENT INTO PERFORMING THESE MODS IS POINTLESS WHEN THAT SAME MONEY CAN BE SPENT BUYING A CAR WITH EQUAL OR GREATER POWER BUILT IN FOR NO EFFORT ON YOUR PART. You're saying "oh there's plenty of cheap ways to make horsepower" when you have
            >not listed any of them
            and
            >made a bunch of assumptions about the car in the OP without actually knowing with what he has, assumptions that nonetheless prove the points made by myself and others in this thread.
            It's wild to me that you're saying that I "know nothing" when you are literally AGREEING with EVERYTHING that I am saying without even realizing what is happening here.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >The entire point of the critique that the OP is mad about is that THE TIME AND MONETARY INVESTMENT INTO PERFORMING THESE MODS IS POINTLESS
            wrong op is mad that people are mad that he did not buy top trim vehicle which is hilarious now that I go back and read it. I'll explain why after this.

            >>not listed any of them
            I listed a bunch. porting and polishing various compenents being the main ones I mentioned. you got mad at that because oh no, eco boost is a good car. this is hilarious because basically what op said is the forum gays get mad you didn't buy the top trim of said car, which would be a coyote mustang innit.
            frickin can't make this shit up. I also listed cheap ways of making power by way of labor trades. which you got mad about because you can't fathom the idea of working for what you want. who's to say the guy asking for opinions isn't getting the parts for free? who's to say the car wasn't an absolute steal? Who tf cares why he wants to modify what he wants to modify.
            I've proven you wrong sit down I havent agreed with a word you said.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >porting and polishing various compenents being the main ones I mentioned.
            >"I have dozens of different kinds of fruits on my farm."
            >"name them."
            >"well I've got lots of apples."
            >"that's not specific enough"
            >"moron pickerlet. I bet you don't even farm."

            >I also listed cheap ways of making power by way of labor trades. which you got mad about because you can't fathom the idea of working for what you want.
            "Working for what you want" is how the fricking world works moron, if I was a trust fund kid do you think I would be posting on fricking DA instead of cruising internationally in a top-end GT? The entire point is that if your current situation allows for different trading or monetary opportunities, you should pick the best opportunity that arises, which for MOST PEOPLE would be saving money and buying a better car. Suggesting random irrelevant bullshit doesn't factor in here, as I could just as easily say that your brother's labor trading strategy was moronic when he could have gotten a job paying $200k+ a year and bought a McLaren for max horsepower.

            >wrong op is mad that people are mad that he did not buy top trim vehicle
            >you got mad at that because oh no, eco boost is a good car.
            Oh, nevermind, you just can't read. I'll move on with my day and let everyone else with literacy above the third grade read this thread and laugh at you.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            All this but coyote mustangs make 360-380whp out the box while a ecoboost blows the frick up after 400whp

            and unless you're getting the parts for the Ecoboost for free you're probably gonna spend the difference between the two purchase price on sick mods ($1500 exhaust, $600 intercooler, $500-700 tune, $700 clutch, etc) making your car less reliable in the process and having to spend time and money

            everything you listed will make negligible amounts of horsepower..these cars are designed with AutoCAD and FEA and Intel i7 computers. If Ford couldn't maximize airflow from the head without a compromise then you definitely could not.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            > If Ford couldn't maximize airflow from the head without a compromise then you definitely could not.
            This is dumb because it ignores the economics of the situation. Ford engineers spend just as much time figuring out which corners they can cut as they spend designing the thing. As the owner, you can uncut those corners if you have the time / money. You can also ignore regulations & emissions.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Which is why porting stuff at best gets you 10-15hp. The optimizations come from adding airflow on either side of the engine, cooling that airflow, and adding fuel for that air. All of that costs money and takes reliability away. Upgrading injectors, fuel pump, exhaust from the turbo, intercooler + piping is easily going to make up the difference that you saved on the 4cyl

            Ford engineers also calculated it would last 150,000 miles at 300hp crank. If you try to make it do 400hp crank it might last 75-100,000 instead. And that's assuming you spend the same amount tuning the car as Ford did during R&D. You might get stupid drivability issues like the car having a hard time starting in cold weather or dying in traffic.

            you're a giga moron wrenchlet to still be on this Ford so powerful they have magic powers. engineers function within parameters that we do not. manufacture processes and packaging, cost of production. all alleviated by some elbow grease. here, argue with a master of this stuff I'm sick of talking to a wrenchlet

            ?si=Xp5MhB2uW4wqQquO

            >you're a giga moron wren-ACK

            I'm not the one trying to push a 4 cylinder to the stock power the V8 makes. You could've had a V8. I'm telling you to save the time and effort if you have the option. Spend that time/money you would have spent making a 2.3 as fast as a 5.0 on a few extra shifts at work. The 2.3 is unironically a shit example because they have a hard limit at a little over what a stock 5.0 makes.

            And what happens when you have to sell the car? Your mods added zero value to the car and if you're smart you kept the stock parts and revert it back to stock and take 50-60% depreciation selling used aftermarket parts. If you're not you try to sell a modded car that everyone will assume was beat to shit for the same price as stock.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >I'm not the one trying to push a 4 cylinder to the stock power the V8 makes.
            neither am I that would be David vizard doing that.
            >Spend that time/money you would have spent making a 2.3 as fast as a 5.0 on a few extra shifts at work
            not everyone has the option for overtime and class restrictions exist

            >The 2.3 is unironically a shit example because they have a hard limit at a little over what a stock 5.0 makes.
            who cares? irrelevant. maybe because it was free, maybe because you're curious, maybe because of class restrictions who knows who cares.
            >And what happens when you have to sell the car? Your mods added zero value to the car and if you're smart you kept the stock parts and revert it back to stock and take 50-60% depreciation selling used aftermarket parts. If you're not you try to sell a modded car that everyone will assume was beat to shit for the same price as stock.
            same thing who cares? again, just admit you had no idea car companies aren't using magic and the engines are not optimal off the factory floor. admit that you are in fact a wrenchlet but now know a bit more about cars. it's okay, this is all anonymous.

            or you can continue to pretend you're moronic and act like you know better than one of the winningest engine builders on the planet. either way everyone here knows you're stupid.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I wrote a long reply but it got refreshed because the photo I wanted to share from this morning was over the 4mb limit. I'm hyperaware of this shit because I literally already built 3x motors, 2x transmissions, etc. You're trading lifespan for horsepower on cars that are often already halfway through their usable life when you mod for more horsepower. I'm not sure why you don't understand there's a give and take.

            >car companies arent magic

            even professional engine builders simply don't have the resources that an oem will have. they don't have hundreds of engines they can destroy at will. they dont have engine test stands with $500,000+ in sensors/monitors connected to a computer running a engine to 200,000 miles in 3 weeks. they don't have tribiologists/petro engineers determining the best oil they can run. they don't have the ability to test a car in literally every environment to make sure it'll start and not randomly die or sputter in the cold/traffic. they don't have aerodynamic/laminar flow modeling to determine headflow.

            even when it comes to manufacturing, most engine builders are lucky to have a clean room. while a oem is working in a perfectly sealed space that resembles a lab, using machines that consistently give the same exact torque for 100s of engines a day, virgin parts with zero heat cycles and perfect tolerances, etc. while a engine builder is lucky if they clean out ALL the swarf generated from honing/decking a block and polishing a crank.

            and this is just the engine. go ahead, put a six puck clutch on your car. don't be surprised when you warp the teeth on the input shaft, notice a few gears missing their teeth, etc. do those drag radials/slicks and destroy your ring and pinion/snap a halfshaft on a hard launch.

            you can do all that, play wrenching enthusiast (read: masochist and time waster), or you can just buy something faster and more capable out the box and spend your free time driving your car and enjoying it. your call.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            and i forgot to add....these new cars are INSANELY fast vs the old shit. even pedestrian shit like 2.0 turbo accords can put down 400whp with exhaust/tune and walk most cars because it has a 10 speed auto so its always in power. stuff like gr86s/nd2s are faster than older cars with the same exact power to weight (e36m3, s2k, etc) because their suspension/chassis is damn near perfect from the factory (they modeled/designed it on a modern computer and not something running windows 98 and its expected to get 5 star crash test rating in 2024).

            something like a 5 year old f80 m3 with a tune (engine + trans) will unironically be faster than most 20-30 year old supercars. tech has made these cars all stupid fast. that's why i actually laugh when DA focuses on laptime shitposting, the cars are so fast it comes down to how they feel individually than whether its a half second faster on laguna seca.

            easier to just cope by saying your car is fun for what it is.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            my dad's car has been in the 10s since the 90s. 1967 fastback with a 460 stroked to I don't remember that much not my car and it's been running fine for all 30 years. even parked it for I think 10 of those years and took it to the track when said older brother told him something like "you probably can't even find your way to the staging lanes". he ran it for a raceday, decided since we were all grown he'd get back into it, and then decided to change the oil and plugs. oil came out like milk, since you're a wrenchlet I'll explain when oil is mixed with water it turns a milky white color. it still runs 10.0s all day. only doesn't go faster because ain't nobody got time or money for licensing and safety equipment to go 9s. car was built from junkyard shit people were scrapping.
            my dad's not an engine builder. he's an Autoglass guy. did he know it would last?no. did it matter?no. cause like you said, and finally was something I can agree with, keep the stock parts he did. stock block and all. of course, it's also a street legal full interior car. keep coping about havin no wrenching experience. you should really just go with calling everyone else a poor gay though so it's okay to not know anything about cars cause you'll pay people that do.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >I have a bunch of shit I want to say that's completely irrelevant to the topic
            I accept your concession.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >irrelevant to the topic

            there's no concession. you're not any different than the youtube mechanics that were claiming you could do a junkyard ls1 swap for $500 in a afternoon a few years ago. i've actually wrenched which is why i know cars don't work in a bubble and there's tradeoffs to literally everything you do. and i know this is hard to accept....but aftermarket companies + engine builders want you to keep spending money. when shit blows up because of their mistake...they take zero accountability because "its for offroad/race use lol'

            heres a motor i had built by one of the "best machine shops" in michigan that was decked at a angle. 4 months later i got it back and the p2ws were instead on the tight side (i found out when this fricking motor kept shedding glitter)

            my dad's car has been in the 10s since the 90s. 1967 fastback with a 460 stroked to I don't remember that much not my car and it's been running fine for all 30 years. even parked it for I think 10 of those years and took it to the track when said older brother told him something like "you probably can't even find your way to the staging lanes". he ran it for a raceday, decided since we were all grown he'd get back into it, and then decided to change the oil and plugs. oil came out like milk, since you're a wrenchlet I'll explain when oil is mixed with water it turns a milky white color. it still runs 10.0s all day. only doesn't go faster because ain't nobody got time or money for licensing and safety equipment to go 9s. car was built from junkyard shit people were scrapping.
            my dad's not an engine builder. he's an Autoglass guy. did he know it would last?no. did it matter?no. cause like you said, and finally was something I can agree with, keep the stock parts he did. stock block and all. of course, it's also a street legal full interior car. keep coping about havin no wrenching experience. you should really just go with calling everyone else a poor gay though so it's okay to not know anything about cars cause you'll pay people that do.

            and now you can run 10s in a tesla plaid or a m3/amg with a tire. your wife can drive it for hours of traffic in comfort and they'll go at least 100,000 miles before stuff breaks

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >you're not any different than the youtube mechanics that were claiming you could do a junkyard ls1 swap for $500 in a afternoon
            to be fair Hatt Mapple was doing pretty much exactly that when he was trying to run 8's with a build sheet as close to 8k as possible. Watching that dude blow up junkard motor after junkyard motor and having it back that the strip the next day was beautiful

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            when did any frickin body say there was zero tradeoff. honestly, anybody cause I missed it. I know I never said there was no tradeoff though so again, irrelevant. matter of fact I said the opposite multiple times when taught you that engineers don't have magical powers to magically have everything perfect 100% of the time.
            I'm 100% different from both that YouTube mechanic and you that says if you port your intake your engines going to blow up into a million pieces and kill your whole family. you ignore the question due to your own ignorance, get mad that you can't answer it, then shit post anyway asking why they want to do it. Who cares? they want to do it. might be a class of racing, might be x y z you're too moronic to comprehend. how many times do I have to prove you're moronic?

            >and now you can run 10s in a tesla plaid or a m3/amg with a tire. your wife can drive it for hours of traffic in comfort and they'll go at least 100,000 miles before stuff breaks
            big woop how many people were doing that in the early 90s when I said he did it? with a platform from the 60s no less.

            >holy frick you absolutely did and are continuing to say exactly that it only works on an ecoboost. the amount of hp doesn't frickin matter you brainlet frick. the point remains that you can gain horsepower for free. of course a wrenchlet frick like you wouldn't know who David vizard is. he's a research engineer with a background in all sorts of racing. if it's got an internal combustion engine he can make it fast. he started out with minis, he's built 1000 hp bb Chevys, everything in between and probably more on that you frickin brainlet wrenchlet racelet frick. I don't care who disagrees with me, im not spouting opinions here I'm spouting facts. the man you saw in that video has built more race winning engines than the amount of cars you've ever owned. if you'll notice in the video, he explains the reasoning behind everything he's doing. why? because it works on everything. atmosphere has no idea if it's going into a small block Chevy, a mini, dirt bike, or top fuel dragster and exhaust has no idea what engine it's leaving either. youre a monumental moron with zero experience in anything you're claiming to understand. wrenchlet moron just concede that you didn't know this stuff and move on with more knowledge than you had a few hours ago.
            Oh this is a GOLDEN new pasta, holy shit.

            and yet despite your worship of engineers you have to keep your moronic narrative alive. who do you think the big companies pay when they need something built fast? protip, it's guys like vizard, Barton, back in the day grumpy. Just admit it, you're not very educated about engines. probably car dynamics at all.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm pretty sure I built more engines than you. It's not engineer worship it's common sense. You or other individuals do not have the resources that a car company has. I don't understand why that's so difficult to wrap your head around. These engine builders will all agree with me if you ask them that. There's only so much you can do to improve the original design before you realize you are just doing Band-Aids. Another example is Ford 302 blocks. They crack in half at 500whp. After certain point the solution is to simply go to a 351 instead of developing Band-Aid after Band-Aid for a flawed design.

            And to answer your question, there's only so much you can port on a modern engine. After a certain point the OEM will do much better than you ever can starting off of a clean sheet. Another example is with what I'm experienced with. A cosworth fully race ported 4g63 Evo 9 head flows less than a stock untouched 4b11 Evo X head. Because there's approximately 20 years of development. One was designed by Mitsu using computers that used Windows 3.0 in 94-95, the other was designed almost 10 years later. If anything these newer engines are pretty well optimized out the box. It's not like 30 years ago where your applying recent developments to an older design engine.

            I'm realizing I'm speaking with somebody who thinks they know what they're talking about but truthfully knows nothing. You obviously haven't wrenched on anything made in the last decade. The same advance since you see in the tech industry trickle down to the rest of society. We have tighter more consistent tolerances than 30 years ago for example. Metallurgy has improved. Even the fluids your cars run have improved

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Another example is Ford 302 blocks. They crack in half at 500whp. After certain point the solution is to simply go to a 351 instead of developing Band-Aid after Band-Aid for a flawed design
            funny you say that before the ls swap my same older brother was running a stock block 302 dynod at north of 600 hp for I think 2 seasons straight. it did not immediately explode and take out his whole family lmao. and actually I think vizard has a video on that as well.
            and then you go and say modern stuff can't be improved despite me showing the ecoboost.

            I'm not arguing buddy, I'm telling you. anyone can put an engine together you fricks tick want a picture of my pc? I built it I think 12 years ago and it still runs modern games. do I know how? frick no! take more pictures of your freshen ups I'm sure it'll convince people you're smarter than the best in the business.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            alright also for newbie car guys that just want to understand but can't I'm gonna tell you. the trade off for things like port and polishing is that it'll take hours. possibly a whole weekend of really boring finicky work. the reason Ford or any other big company doesn't do it from the factory is because well, it'll take hours of really boring, and really finicky work. that raises the price of the car exponentially when the engineers they hired are smart enough to package things conveniently across platforms, keep maintenance labor and parts cost down, and maintain reliability. all these things you don't care so much about when you're competing in races. it'd be like being mad that a puzzle takes work but your hobby is doing puzzles. get your start whenever you can, real world test your work, and see what works and what's bs for yourself. don't listen to negative nancies like the anon who thinks every car is made exactly how you want it from the factory, and they have magical powers that can produce maximum power, reliability, and affordability all at the same time. he's a snake oil salesman. and honestly you'll find a lot more enjoyment with the hobby chasing that next faster time than just buying the car that already does it (assuming you have that kind of money which I know most of us don't )

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Another example is Ford 302 blocks. They crack in half at 500whp. After certain point the solution is to simply go to a 351 instead of developing Band-Aid after Band-Aid for a flawed design
            funny you say that before the ls swap my same older brother was running a stock block 302 dynod at north of 600 hp for I think 2 seasons straight. it did not immediately explode and take out his whole family lmao. and actually I think vizard has a video on that as well.
            and then you go and say modern stuff can't be improved despite me showing the ecoboost.

            I'm not arguing buddy, I'm telling you. anyone can put an engine together you fricks tick want a picture of my pc? I built it I think 12 years ago and it still runs modern games. do I know how? frick no! take more pictures of your freshen ups I'm sure it'll convince people you're smarter than the best in the business.

            Also, remember that there's gearheads that spend huge amounts of time and money to race their briggs and Stratton. yes, that exists. they might get excited at idk actual numbers but seeing they can hit 55 highway speed. it's what they like doing. anons like the one I've proven wrong at every goal post he's moved to doesn't actually like cars or racing this is just some way to get rid of pent up rage or something. idk why they do it tbh. be happy with the car you've got, try to consume as much information as you can for what works, test it and see for yourself. it's gonna be fun whether you've got a civic or amg Mercedes. signing off cause like I said I'm sick of talking to a wrenchlet

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            To be fair, having the fastest stock-appearing Briggs and Stratton is actually crucial in the lower classes of kart racing. You can't be obviously cheating but it sucks to have a slower kart in an already slow class.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            hey someone that gets it showed up. well yeah of course that's a big reason to care about using a less than suitable platform. amongst others. I was actually thinking of the guys that race lawn mowers though tbh.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            All I'm saying is that your information is out of date imo and with a lot of these newer engines are already very well optimized from the factory. It's not like you're dealing with a mid-90s engine like a Chevy LT1 where you can just port the frick out of the heads for a free 100hp on a 300hp engine. I can tell you for a fact ported vs unported (manifolds, head) for Evos is probably around 10% extra power...and that's a DOHC turbo car from the mid 90s running 21psi stock (28-31psi often modded). The newer stuff is gonna be even less. The best you can do is let them breathe and tune for it if it's turbo or add a cam if it's a pushrod V8 like a Hemi or LS/LT.

            alright also for newbie car guys that just want to understand but can't I'm gonna tell you. the trade off for things like port and polishing is that it'll take hours. possibly a whole weekend of really boring finicky work. the reason Ford or any other big company doesn't do it from the factory is because well, it'll take hours of really boring, and really finicky work. that raises the price of the car exponentially when the engineers they hired are smart enough to package things conveniently across platforms, keep maintenance labor and parts cost down, and maintain reliability. all these things you don't care so much about when you're competing in races. it'd be like being mad that a puzzle takes work but your hobby is doing puzzles. get your start whenever you can, real world test your work, and see what works and what's bs for yourself. don't listen to negative nancies like the anon who thinks every car is made exactly how you want it from the factory, and they have magical powers that can produce maximum power, reliability, and affordability all at the same time. he's a snake oil salesman. and honestly you'll find a lot more enjoyment with the hobby chasing that next faster time than just buying the car that already does it (assuming you have that kind of money which I know most of us don't )

            Yeah but with modern computers, sensors, and test rigs they seriously lowered the time it takes to do R&D. Ever notice how new cars and engines went from coming out every 8-12 years to every 3-5 years? Moore's law trickled down to the automotive sector.

            The snake oil salesmen are the automotive aftermarket guys who claim there's a free lunch. Turns out when you build stuff for "off-road use only" you don't have a warranty...ask Toyota, Hyundai, or GM what happens when they frick up a engine (tons of shitposting on social media for starters, followed by warranty claims that can run into the billions). There's more accountability at the manufacturer level. If a shop can't tune cars and blows them the frick up they lose business but the reputation loss is limited to the local area. If a manufacturer fricks up the reputation loss is for decades and spans internationally.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            all of that is completely irrelevant wrenchlet.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I have posted engines I've built, posted a picture of me back probing a knock sensor harness from this morning, and here's my rear diff from the same car (restacked clutch plates)

            Post things you have done. I'm not a wrenchlet, I'm also not stupid enough to brag about wasting my time wrenching instead of driving my car. I own the direct successor to a DSM (remember, the car that made normal people into mechanics since 1990?).

            [...]
            Also, remember that there's gearheads that spend huge amounts of time and money to race their briggs and Stratton. yes, that exists. they might get excited at idk actual numbers but seeing they can hit 55 highway speed. it's what they like doing. anons like the one I've proven wrong at every goal post he's moved to doesn't actually like cars or racing this is just some way to get rid of pent up rage or something. idk why they do it tbh. be happy with the car you've got, try to consume as much information as you can for what works, test it and see for yourself. it's gonna be fun whether you've got a civic or amg Mercedes. signing off cause like I said I'm sick of talking to a wrenchlet

            Again, you haven't posted any actual work you've done.

            I'm over it, I'd rather just drive the fricking car than spend hours working on it. I'm not a wrenching enthusiast and I have better things to do than autistic time sinks.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm a computer genius guys see! I assembled a computer! lmfao!
            I don't take pictures of my work for strangers homosexual I post them to Facebook. I ain't getting reverse image doxed.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            So you're a liar on the internet. Your work isn't that unique that anyone actually cares about who you are. You're not a celebrity nor have you posted any compromising information. I'm glad you can go build computers at least you're not lying about everything extreme toona. Stick to building computers and cars from the prehistoric era (and I'm being generous to give you the benefit of the doubt on the latter)

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            he's also too stupid too understand I was making fun of him! lmfao. unless you are a celebrity on the caliber of vizard, grumpy Jenkins, and David Barton I would stand corrected.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            dance for me wrenchlet

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I hate drag racing so much it's unreal

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            honestly with your level of knowledge I'd be surprised if you understood why the hole for your crosspin is shaped the way it is. you're an absolute moron angry at the idea other people are experimenting and learning. I know youre stupid because you seeth at the idea someone would ever study and experiment with things on their own. you're angry that people are faster than you at the track when their car isn't factory, the professionals that were totally trying to build a race car in you opinion. you're an idiot. Mexicans that can't do algebra assemble our engines and you think it's an accomplishment.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah I'm not gonna let the aftermarket automotive industry sell dumb gullible kids a lie about being the next extreme tuna that can totally beat lambos if you do a few simple mods to your mom's 2006 accord.

            Crosspin is shaped so the spider gears can rotate on the pin and allow a certain amount of slip for one wheel. And if it's not Mexicans building your engines today it's Black folk and alcoholic pot smoking high school dropouts in Michigan since the 1960s. Again, you just lack common sense and think you can do better. I'm not discouraging anyone, I'm telling them the reality isn't what the YouTube mechanics tell you. Your time and energy in your youth is unironically limited and after a certain point your time stops being free. The time and money spent hopping up a shitbox (or slower car) could be spent simply selling your old one and buying the faster one (to answer OPs question, there are some platforms that simply fricking SUCK and others where it's unironically not worth spending the $$$ because the next step up is way more than it's worth spending). And you avoid the downtime that could be spent on driving enjoyment. There's nothing SLOWER than a car stuck on jackstands/doesn't run under its own power.

            >Again, you haven't posted any actual work you've done.
            It's because this [...] is his car.

            He's a coping shitbox owner that got his car snickered at and he never recovered.

            Depressing. He's going to do all that work to run the same 1/4 mile as a leased F150. That's why I never bothered with drag racing. All that time and effort to just get rolled up by some moron with a leased B58 BMW with a horsepower download from their phone or something like a 10 speed 3.5 F150.

            Probably autistic.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Depressing. He's going to do all that work to run the same 1/4 mile as a leased F150. That's why I never bothered with drag racing. All that time and effort to just get rolled up by some moron with a leased B58 BMW with a horsepower download from their phone or something like a 10 speed 3.5 F150.
            incorrect I'm buying said 302 (well its actually a 333 now) that makes north of 600 hp from my brother. if he ever gives me a price it actually seems like he's just gonna give it to me no charge.
            >Crosspin is shaped so the spider gears can rotate on the pin and allow a certain amount of slip for one wheel.
            I'm pretty sure you know so little you misunderstood my question lmao. I frickin knew it.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Alright, enjoy wasting your time wrenching. I'll enjoy driving my car. Eventually responsibilities catch up, you have sex, get a girl pregnant or a job that has you working all the time, and your project car becomes a BURDEN. Remember, there's nothing SLOWER than a BROKEN car on JACKSTANDS while everyone else is enjoying their cars.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            didnt I mention my dad's car? his still works and is a great joy to all 6 of his boys. all on not just a mechanics salary, but a mechanic that works for his dad's salary. I think he was making about 150 a week in the 90s.
            Anyway, not the point. do you think everyone playing hockey or golf into their 40s thinks they're going pro? or do you think the just enjoy the sport. practice and all. you're a fricking clueless moron. you picked on me for making assumptions about ops car (I did not op didn't say I created what's called a hypothetical situation) and now we end with you saying that you're mad that young people can enjoy a hobby because they don't have a family. which again, you're the ONLY one whose made an assumption about this. there's guys out there right now grinding out runescape gold despite it being worth like 30 cents an hour and you're mad at automotive hobbyists for wanting to go faster in what they got? you're a wrenchlet, racelet,homosexual Karen. that's the end of it.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >talks all this shit about adding b00st to a shitbox
            >"well actually I'm just upgrading the entire engine to an actually good one so-"
            We accept your concession.

            You're getting picked on for being a wrenchlet, for being inexperienced, and for trying to sell dumb impressionable kids the YouTuber mechanic bullshit where you can do a full build in a afternoon with $500 and a six pack.

            Your time is LIMITED. Get that into your skull. Do you want to waste your 20s wrenching on a shitbox? Or do you want to spend time ENJOYING driving? It is all a MONEY GAME. If you have more money you can build BETTER and you're not coping fricking around with 1990s asthmatic shitboxes with fricked paint.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm not getting picked on, you've got that mistaken from the rip. the white girls are laughing at you cause I've proven you wrong at literally every single goal post you picked

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >the white girls are laughing at you cause I've proven you wrong at literally every single goal post you picked
            This is next level delusion kek

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >You're getting picked on for being a wrenchlet, for being inexperienced, and for trying to sell dumb impressionable kids the YouTuber mechanic bullshit where you can do a full build in a afternoon with $500 and a six pack.
            Also, come with receipts pussy. I never said anything like that again I said the opposite in that tradeoffs might be hours of your time.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >talks all this shit about adding b00st to a shitbox
            >"well actually I'm just upgrading the entire engine to an actually good one so-"
            We accept your concession.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm the guy who talked about boosting shitboxes, I've done 2 now and you're the blackest gorilla Black person ever if you tell people it's hard, expensive or can't be done.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >he still doesn't get it

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >he greentexts non-arguments

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            There's no argument to be made considering no one said that it was hard or couldn't be done, just that it was a massive waste of money and time when you could get a car with that work already done to it for the same amount of cash it would take to do it yourself.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            nah probably not

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            It's going to depend on the car of course, but these are shitboxes we're talking about. Getting one with a turbo option can probably be done for the SAME amount of money, if anything. It'll just be a different make and model.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            nah probably not

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            nah probably not

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Glad you agree

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            nah probably not

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            that's the spirit

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            none of the card I've mentioned in my personal life are boosted. my dad's is carbureted, my brothers is Holley efi. mines carberated. every single one is naturally aspirated. I will be the first to tell you I know nothing about supercharged motors. all I know about that is from vizards experiments with his ecoboost motor and I haven't seen all his content about that.

            see that? you can admit you don't know something. now just do it. admit you didn't know cars can be made more to ones preference from the factory floor and you didn't know that. we're good.
            i accept your concession

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Yeah, we knew you didn't know anything about the shit you were posting earlier. Thanks for confirming.

            >admit you didn't know cars can be made more to ones preference from the factory floor and you didn't know that.
            ?????????????????????????????
            Who the frick doesn't know this LMAO, it wasn't even discussed.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            op asked about it.

            https://i.imgur.com/iJTshJK.jpeg

            > Get cheap low mile 2 door tuner car
            > See many affordable ways to add Performance/HP
            > Go to car forums for opinions
            > See non-stop salty remarks to whomever is seeking any sort of performance advice on stock cars
            > "Why didn't you buy the performance x-version of car ($10k more) or find used one (still $6k more)

            Help me understand why people are like this?
            Say >person< with limited income comes into good condition low-end performance car.
            Wants to spend $1-2k on upgrades and people make tons on personal and financial attacks on said person.
            I've seen this same attitude on Motorcycle & Bicycle forums as well.

            >> Get cheap low mile 2 door tuner car
            >> See many affordable ways to add Performance/HP
            >> Go to car forums for opinions
            >> See non-stop salty remarks to whomever is seeking any sort of performance advice on stock cars
            >> "Why didn't you buy the performance x-version of car ($10k more) or find used one (still $6k more
            see moron? you're the salty moron he's talking about.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            the people giving that advice aren't wrong. you're gonna pay it back in time wasted and effort. they're giving good advice and looking out for your best interest because they already did it

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            did the op ask if it was the best way to spend his time or money? no they ask a straightforward question then 12 people jump in "you shoulda got a x y or z" until sometimes someone that knows cars pops in at the end to answer the question.

            What does literally any of this have to do with something being made "to preference from the factory floor?" Are you ESL?

            If you're trying to say that someone might like the car the way it is and just want to upgrade the performance for shits and giggles, you might realize that NOBODY SAID THIS WAS A BAD THING. If you DON'T care about the car and are just chasing horsepower because you want to be cool, then buying a shitbox and throwing money into it is moronic when you can just BUY A FASTER CAR. How are you this braindead dude?

            >If you're trying to say that someone might like the car the way it is and just want to upgrade the performance for shits and giggles, you might realize that NOBODY SAID THIS WAS A BAD THING. If you DON'T care about the car and are just chasing horsepower because you want to be cool, then buying a shitbox and throwing money into it is moronic when you can just BUY A FASTER CAR. How are you this braindead dude?
            you literally are saying all of that by instead of answering an op question you go off an some stupid tangent wondering what he's doing what he's doing you fricking moron. Just admit you don't know, sit back, and hope someone that does know chimes in you frickin moronic wrenchlet brainlet .that way, you won't be the butthole op of this thread is talking about. I'm glad you put your Lego box engines together. I'm sorry for you that you specd it all wrong and are now salty about it wrenchlet .

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >did the op ask if it was the best way to spend his time or money?
            OP read other people being told they made a bad call buying a shitbox and then came on here to b***h about people like him being told they made a bad call buying a shitbox.

            OP didn't ask for any advice at all. He came on to dilate and is now being told to continue doing so.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >an op question
            I very deliberately did not say this threads op moron.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Oh, good to hear that you read through all of the threads not linked by OP that we don't know anything about then. You're so smart anon!

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            right because it would be embarrassing to not remember the lifetime of experience being through the same process. it's amazing to me that your so stupid I'm still smarter than you after being idk this many beers deep

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >right because it would be embarrassing to not remember the lifetime of experience being through the same process
            Allow me to add to your experience: your car is hot garbage and it looks like shit.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            you can be salty about it all you want won't change the fact that this time next year it'll be better lookin and faster than anything you'll ever own.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You couldn't catch me dead in a mustang of that year but okie dokie buddy bojangles

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            well how the frick would you catch up to get in lmao?
            Anyway final words for the finer birds. what's similar between a 12 second civic and a 9 second mustang? they both make me rock hard.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I don't care about being faster than you. There are zoomer youtubers crashing cars way faster than either of ours daily and buying new ones as soon as they wake up the next morning. There's always a faster fish, and the fastest fishes are buying fricking planes, not cars.

            You're just a know-nothing butthole with a chip on his shoulder because people look at your car and cringe. I have a built big block sitting out in the yard (and it runs), so if you think I have anything to prove to you I'm afraid to say that I'll have forgotten about this thread long before it gets archived.

            Goodbye.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            lmfao okay I did check before bed I meant to leave it be but can you imagine such a cope? I can't. mfer tells everyone else engineers at the big corporations have magical powers to produce engines that you cannot possibly ever improve on, and ends saying he's got an engine he's done just that to. he literally just admitted I beat him that's never happened before on the internet lmfao.
            seriously though Honda guys. when those motors spin up like a frickin sport bike ive gotta hide my shame from the ladies and gentlemen around.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I'm not that anon, so.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Leaf me alone you bully.
            I Told you before im faster than you, and you just seem to have an issue with being beaten by a girl, even if i was male at one point

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            What does literally any of this have to do with something being made "to preference from the factory floor?" Are you ESL?

            If you're trying to say that someone might like the car the way it is and just want to upgrade the performance for shits and giggles, you might realize that NOBODY SAID THIS WAS A BAD THING. If you DON'T care about the car and are just chasing horsepower because you want to be cool, then buying a shitbox and throwing money into it is moronic when you can just BUY A FASTER CAR. How are you this braindead dude?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Again, you haven't posted any actual work you've done.
            It's because this

            https://i.imgur.com/Eb8lUSw.jpeg

            based. kinda what I'm up to except I didn't do the swap I bought it this way, hence why I know nothing about it. the guy I bought it from didn't either it was his kids brother in laws car or something wierd like that. he thought the transmission was in the trunk, we found it bolted to the motor for perspective. Anyway 302 swapped, transmission was a blown up c4. got that fixed and rebuilt the carb so far it runs and drives okay now but open header still and I've got a cervini cowl hood on the way and some paint cause that ones ugly af. have some weld wheels but running low on cash so gonna take a break for a bit in it. shitty picture through my works shop window related

            is his car.

            He's a coping shitbox owner that got his car snickered at and he never recovered.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            trying for another angle I see. that cars torqe boxes are absolutely mint, there's no rust on the shock towers at all not even surface rust. not only that it's been in a warehouse for the last 15 years there's 0 sun damage to any of the plastic or rubbers. lastly, I've got a cervini hood on the way and paint because I actually do wrench and will be doing that myself in my shop, as well as weld wheels ready to go on it. Just admit you're a wrenchlet it's fine.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            oh, total cost so far, 2000. car tax title wheels and hood and paint. wouldn't even be that high but I've got a bronco I needed primer for so I got a gallon

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            you're a giga moron wrenchlet to still be on this Ford so powerful they have magic powers. engineers function within parameters that we do not. manufacture processes and packaging, cost of production. all alleviated by some elbow grease. here, argue with a master of this stuff I'm sick of talking to a wrenchlet

            ?si=Xp5MhB2uW4wqQquO

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >posts a video about HP gains for a car that's completely unrelated to his shitbox
            cope of this magnitude simply cannot be fabricated.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >nooo this stuff only works on an eco boost mustang!!
            I accept your concession wrenchlet.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            you realize there's multiple people here that think you're moronic right
            >only works on an ecoboost
            nobody said this dipshit, i said that the video's claims of "up to 30 HP" are only going to apply to this specific engine (which he did not dyno btw so it's a completely meaningless statement)

            go clean the turbo on your shitbox bro. i'm sure you'll be dusting all your tuner friends in no time.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            holy frick you absolutely did and are continuing to say exactly that it only works on an ecoboost. the amount of hp doesn't frickin matter you brainlet frick. the point remains that you can gain horsepower for free. of course a wrenchlet frick like you wouldn't know who David vizard is. he's a research engineer with a background in all sorts of racing. if it's got an internal combustion engine he can make it fast. he started out with minis, he's built 1000 hp bb Chevys, everything in between and probably more on that you frickin brainlet wrenchlet racelet frick. I don't care who disagrees with me, im not spouting opinions here I'm spouting facts. the man you saw in that video has built more race winning engines than the amount of cars you've ever owned. if you'll notice in the video, he explains the reasoning behind everything he's doing. why? because it works on everything. atmosphere has no idea if it's going into a small block Chevy, a mini, dirt bike, or top fuel dragster and exhaust has no idea what engine it's leaving either. youre a monumental moron with zero experience in anything you're claiming to understand. wrenchlet moron just concede that you didn't know this stuff and move on with more knowledge than you had a few hours ago.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >holy frick you absolutely did and are continuing to say exactly that it only works on an ecoboost. the amount of hp doesn't frickin matter you brainlet frick. the point remains that you can gain horsepower for free. of course a wrenchlet frick like you wouldn't know who David vizard is. he's a research engineer with a background in all sorts of racing. if it's got an internal combustion engine he can make it fast. he started out with minis, he's built 1000 hp bb Chevys, everything in between and probably more on that you frickin brainlet wrenchlet racelet frick. I don't care who disagrees with me, im not spouting opinions here I'm spouting facts. the man you saw in that video has built more race winning engines than the amount of cars you've ever owned. if you'll notice in the video, he explains the reasoning behind everything he's doing. why? because it works on everything. atmosphere has no idea if it's going into a small block Chevy, a mini, dirt bike, or top fuel dragster and exhaust has no idea what engine it's leaving either. youre a monumental moron with zero experience in anything you're claiming to understand. wrenchlet moron just concede that you didn't know this stuff and move on with more knowledge than you had a few hours ago.
            Oh this is a GOLDEN new pasta, holy shit.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Name them.
            10 point cage with parachute
            3 piece discontinued JoJo frontend
            spec-R full drag suspension
            Fuel cell with -8 lines from tank to motor
            1 044 bosch pump
            1200 rc injectors
            golden eagle sleeved block
            cp 10:1 pistons
            Eagle rods
            arp headstuds
            oem h22 headgasket
            Balance shaft delete
            competition clutch twin disc
            Port and polished head
            skunk2 valve springs and retainers
            Str cam gears
            crower stage 1 cams
            aluminium radiator with slim fan
            gsr transmission with itr lsd.
            qsd h2k intake manifold adapter
            k20 rbc manifold
            qsd throttle body spacer
            blox 70mm throttle body
            4bar omni map sensor
            6al msd with coil and cap. 3 step launch control
            hks bov
            Garret 102mm turbocharger.
            Custom t4 front facing turbo manifold with 44mm flange
            44mm tial wastegate
            Custom water to air intercooler set up
            aem eugo wideband w/ gauge
            tuned on chipped p28
            13 inch volks drag rims
            2 15 inch volks rear rims
            arp extended wheel studs
            si cluster
            150 shots of nitrous im making 348 horsepower to the FRONT WHEELS because thats the only place the power should ever be

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            348 whp and you have done all that? ............ my focus st has 320 and it only cost 2.5k for the bigger turbo 600 for an intercooler 1500 for coil overs and 500 for urethane motor mounts. Why did you do all that for subpar numbers?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Anon is a true marvel, a rogue actor, a lone wolf, like a blind man swimming against the tide he stands alone in a world made of steel. Chances were low for the man behind the wheel but he carries on anyway, defiant in the face of all odds.
            Some say he does it for the memes.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            There are lots of things here that are definitely NOT free.

            How much did this cost in total?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            You dare doubt Civic anon?

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            I don't even know who that is.

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            he has but a few simple mods

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            Then your injector gets stuck open or you get a bad tank of gas and it blows up, or your clutch/auto trans originally meant for maybe 50hp over stock starts slipping.

            "eBay turbos" only work when the tuning labor fabrication is free and it's a overbuilt brick shithouse of a engine (most of which are in cars that aren't cheap anymore like ka24s in 240sxs and obd1 2jzges) and even then they die spontaneous death

            [...]
            And now you're running premium in a Camry

            [...]
            Kinda realized that when I spent a lot of money using a 5 year old F80 M3 as a benchmark...only to be slightly faster than a stock one with a lot more compromises

            Also that's not why I called you dumb actually it was the statement about engineers designing it so there's no improvements to be made. those same engineers would tell you that's no true. they have a lot of constraints they have to work within that Joe blow doesn't

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >And even then a used G80 M3 is already hitting low 60s
            And an m240i is half the price

          • 4 weeks ago
            Anonymous

            >Stage

        • 4 weeks ago
          Anonymous

          the 3vzfe in the 3rd gen camry can get about 10 free hp by simply advancing the timing to 17 degrees btdc (14 if you get pinging), and leaning out the very rich factory fuel mix by turning the cog inside the air flow meter clockwise a few clicks.
          the stock front exhaust coming from each bank connects via an incredibly awful, inefficient T-junction that has a baffle in it that restricts flow even further. getting a proper Y-pipe results in a small but noticeable increase in mid-range power.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Don't know that I'd call it cope as opposed to ignorance. Definitely should have started with something faster though.

  2. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >buy a corolla
    >everyone laughs you out the door
    >come to DA to whinge about it
    you got gatekept hard homosexual shoulda saved your mcdonalds wage a bit longer

  3. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    6-10k is nothing when you start modding cars. your cold air intake didnt do shit

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      imo mods are all about your personal enjoyment and the smiles per gallon attitude. it's generally true that it's cheaper to buy a faster car outright, but what kind of homosexual doesn't like working on and modding their own shit

      yeah, throwing a grand at most cars won't do frick all outside of the aforementioned tunes for very specific engines

      Having been there done that, a lot of times you are better getting a shitter model that hasnt been abused vs an abused performance model. For example, finding a cheap audi a4 isn't too hard, but an s4 is guaranteed gonna be owned by some spicrican who ruined it. Spend a day at the junkyard and swap the performance motor and trans in from an a6 and be happy. To further this point however you will see a lot of people suffer to get 500hp from a 1.8t when its far easier and cheaper to get that from a 2.7t. Again personal example but I have a lot of experience with that chassis and Im a mechanic by trade.

      Anythings possible though, I built a pretty crazy econoshitter which involved a lot of blood sweat and tears but I also learned a huge number of skills from it and get some crazy looks from guys with actual performance cars once they catch up.

      >get some crazy looks from guys with actual performance cars
      yeah, my econobox isn't fast, but it's noticeably faster than it would be stock. I really want to 6spd swap and turbo it, but rust has turned it to a literal money pit. it'll occasionally btfo first gen 86s and older "sports" cars (yes I know, so impressive) and the people driving those look absolutely shocked that some c**t in a rusted sedan just beat them. hell, I recently kept up with a g37 and a 3 series, and those guys had visible confusion when they had to fully hammer it to actually get past me

      • 4 weeks ago
        Anonymous

        1000USD will easily turbo any engine common enough to have a Ebay turbo kit
        or it can turbo ANY engine if you have the 80+IQ required for welding

  4. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Forums are full of people with a superiority complex

  5. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    here's the real and honest answer, if you're looking for something specific in terms of power, then sure go mod it. If you're just looking for more power, then why would you spend 10k on mods when you could honestly spend that on a performance spec (if applicable.) So while they are toxic as frick, it does make sense to bring up that point.

  6. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    What car is it anon?

    Also to be clear, a lot of forums do get those kinds of questions very often. You'd be surprised how many people hear about how they can build up an engine to make giga-HP "with a few simple mods" and go to forums asking about it only for at-length discussions to be had about why for a lot of engines this simply isn't true. Even when it comes to something as common as adding forced induction to an engine you sometimes have to do more than just slap the turbo on there and zoom off. You have to prep the engine if it isn't an engine already made to handle FI, which can involve swapping out a lot of internal parts and, depending on how much boost you're adding, may require you to tear down the entire engine and replace important sealant and rotating assembly components, to say nothing of the expense of forged internals depending on the amount of extra pressure you're expecting to add.

    At that point you're not doing "a few simple mods." You're doing a rebuild. And if you're doing a rebuild, then the obvious question must be asked: why are you doing a $5-10k operation on a shitbox when you could have put that extra $5-10k towards a car that has already had all of this done professionally and properly? You might say "sure I can swap the headers for less money" or "but what if I add high-flow DFI," and the answer is going to be that outside of a few engines/setups for which this is a significant gain, the amount of HP you'll get from that level of modding will generally be somewhat negligible, since the power gained from those mods scales with how much power has already been squeezed out of the other components of the engine. Swapping the headers on a high-end V6/V8 with heavy compression and high internal volume/piston travel? Great. Adding high-flow DFI to an engine with a properly-tuned high-volume FI system and a rotating assembly that can handle the extra power? Excellent. Doing these things without the essentials in place? Pointless.

  7. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Car forum boomers and facebook group Black folk are the worst, even worse than DA.
    You see someone ask a perfectly reasonable question and all you get is:
    >you can't do that
    >it won't work for all these reasons I made up (has no first hand experience and is wrong)
    >why would you want to do that it's a waste of time anyway
    >just do what I did and (pay lots of money)

    Just yesterday I happened across an old forum post that made me rage so hard I nearly dug it up from 15 years ago to tell all the naysaying boomers they were actually completely wrong.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      >facebook group Black folk
      kek, i asked about a particular car i thought looked fricking cool with its army green paint job and someone says "you should just paint yours the paint's not perfect" like yeah, I totally expect to buy a 50+ year old car used and painted by the army thinking it's gonna have a concours condition body lmao

  8. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    How much did you overpay for your CA18DE anon?
    Let me guess it was a super clean auto

  9. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Only the chassis of a car matters. everything else can be upgraded or replaced. Especially with older cars, it's easier said than done to "just buy a better version". Most people making these replies just want to hear themselves speak.

  10. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Having been there done that, a lot of times you are better getting a shitter model that hasnt been abused vs an abused performance model. For example, finding a cheap audi a4 isn't too hard, but an s4 is guaranteed gonna be owned by some spicrican who ruined it. Spend a day at the junkyard and swap the performance motor and trans in from an a6 and be happy. To further this point however you will see a lot of people suffer to get 500hp from a 1.8t when its far easier and cheaper to get that from a 2.7t. Again personal example but I have a lot of experience with that chassis and Im a mechanic by trade.

    Anythings possible though, I built a pretty crazy econoshitter which involved a lot of blood sweat and tears but I also learned a huge number of skills from it and get some crazy looks from guys with actual performance cars once they catch up.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      based. kinda what I'm up to except I didn't do the swap I bought it this way, hence why I know nothing about it. the guy I bought it from didn't either it was his kids brother in laws car or something wierd like that. he thought the transmission was in the trunk, we found it bolted to the motor for perspective. Anyway 302 swapped, transmission was a blown up c4. got that fixed and rebuilt the carb so far it runs and drives okay now but open header still and I've got a cervini cowl hood on the way and some paint cause that ones ugly af. have some weld wheels but running low on cash so gonna take a break for a bit in it. shitty picture through my works shop window related

  11. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because people with no agency hate it when you can do something on your own. All they can do is spend money from their cube-cuck make work job.

    They can't embody the spirit of old school hot rodding, which was always about making whatever you had a little bit more fun to drive.

  12. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    Because they're crabs in a bucket insufferable subhumans who should have offed themself 10 years ago, welcome to the new world where you wish the sun would explode already so that this sad excuse of a species can die out.

  13. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    In the case of new cars, it's typically better to go for the higher trim unless its a stupidly priced limited edition etc that offers no real benefit over a lower trim.
    For classic cars, it's often better to opt for the significantly cheaper lower trim and put the money into upgrading it to exceed the higher trim. Because especially for classic cars, you're going to need to dump money into them anyway, so the savings from buying a lower trim can go further.
    Example, 4ac vs 4age AE86. 4ac model can be had for a lot less. Both are flogged to shit so the 4age model would need an engine rebuild potentially or at least a lot of work. Difference in initial purchase price can go towards an engine to upgrade the 4ac with.
    Same for most classic muscle cars.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      OP is talking about tuners so none of the other stuff on here is relevant.

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      Wrong, the best move for muscle cars is to get a poverty-spec that's been engine swapped. It's lost its numbers-matching status so it doesn't get the ridiculous price-bump, and someone has already done the work for you so the expense is lessened by several orders of magnitude.

  14. 4 weeks ago
    Anonymous

    >buy 2.2 s10
    >ask about possible turbo kit for 2.2 s10
    >everyone asks why didn't you get a vortech 4.3 (price margin is negligable)
    >complain because you're too lazy to do research but want plug and play power and don't want to use the search function on the forum
    Why are people like this? Is this clown behavior a result of facebook, reddit, and youtube?

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      The transphobes are obsessed lol...
      Imagine spending so much time worrying about whether to dress as a boy or a girl!
      Closeted much??
      Lmao

    • 4 weeks ago
      Anonymous

      It's because they jumped at the first thing that looked cool and then panicked after doing a little more research and realizing that they could have dumped a couple hundred more bucks into something way better and become fixated on making their car into something that people don't think is lame.

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