Porsche galvanized theirs in the 1980s, too. Even when you see clapped out shells that've been open to the elements for months in junkyards, you still don't see any corrosion on their chassis. I don't know if they ever stopped or cheaped out on it later on, though.
The pic I posted was a mexican trying to sell a tacoma. I daily a 97 4runner in salt country with zero rust issues because I keep an eye on it.
2 years ago
Anonymous
How do you control it?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Fluid film everything every year and spray the underside off at least once a week all winter. I go to a self serve car wash and just assume I'm going to get frostbite while I clean off every nook. It also helped that the truck was boomer owned and garage kept before I got it.
>ten year guarantee for rust
That doesn't actually mean shit unless you get it inspected early in the stealership. Toyotas from the 00s onward seem to be holding up the best though.
2 years ago
Anonymous
*yearly
2 years ago
Anonymous
>Toyotas from the 00s onward seem to be holding up the best though.
Trucks with unibody construction have to beware of rust the most. Or else if they get on a lift, their weakened unibody welds and spot welds break free in the bed area if the vehicle is lifted.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Don't really get a lot of those in Europe. We had the Auris, Avensis and other derivations of those instead.
Haha...dude this was a tacoma in a facebook post and the beaner selling it basically said that "it still runs fine" and that he's been driving it for years like that. Sometimes a smartass shitpost is actually what people think
Yes. Subarus, Toyotas and Hondas all rust out less then their us equivalents. 2010s American cars all have body rot while the Japanese brands don't. Same thing with trucks. Last gen Tundras don't have the massive body rot any the big 3 steel body trucks have
my 82 golf has like 1/4" thick rubber coating in every wheel well and on most of the undercarriage from the factory. I don't know if any new brands give a shit though.
all coatings find a way of failing eventually, what i've found with factory rubberised coatings is their effectiveness is linked to how well adhered they are to the underlaying surface, on the early golfs it seems to be stuck on pretty well so if rust does start to creep under it, it's a slow process, on a BMW i had with a similar type of undercoating it seemed to accelerate the rusting process due to poor adhesion, so surface preparation at the factory would appear to be a critical aspect of how well these types of coatings work
guess I'm lucky to not live in a shitty rustbelt state. I guess it makes the coating kind of useless anyway though since my car wouldn't rust out without it anyway.
The moisture trapping happens because the coating dries up and starts cracking so water can get through the cracks.
I've looked into it and basically if you would want to protect the underside you would have to clean all the rust spots to bare metal, paint it with anti-corrosion primer, base coat (optional), spray on an anti-gravel layer and use special wax on top of that so it doesnt crack and suck up moisture. Additionally you also have to spray a special wax inside all the closed off spaces in the framework so they dont start rusting from the inside.
It's a lot of work but the car will probably be pristine for a long time after that.
I saw this unusually-shaped but obviously somewhat recent bmw in the parking lot the other days with all tint and rims and the rest. And the rear quarter panels look like somebody grabbed them off of a 90s subaru. I've never particularly associated bmws with hideous rust problems.
Except the first gens did you fricking moron. You're even dumber for thinking paint would slide off in a sheet and take on the shape of deformed plastic. You had one job to do and you were too fricking dumb to do it.
I'd say it definitely depends. A lot of Euro cars rust. Either through bad design, bad rust protection or just bad luck. In my case nearly all 3. The Saab 9-5 rusts at the arches where the metal meets the plastic bumper as you can see. I've got some friends with older BMWs/Mercs and it's the same shit. Rust every where, albeit hidden.
nah its the opposite, water collects on the lip of the inside of the hood when it rains and sits there for a long time, causing rust to eventually make its way through the metal
i drive a 2006 matrix with a 5 speed manual. one day i took it to get the lower control arm replaced and the mechanic asked me if the car gets driven to the beach often because the car bottom was very rusted. yeah, i might have driven it a few times to the beach.
over 200,000 miles on it and the thing is still driving.
Are there any manufacturers who take anti-corrosion seriously?
80s Vulva > 90s and Ferd era Vulva
Aluminum body ferd truggs. Japanese cars. That's it.
had 2 Mazdas - 323f (2003), 3 (2004)
both melted like aspirin in the rain
got a Volvo (S80 - 2005) in hope i don't ever have to deal with rust and because they're cool.
in my research, I browsed swedish second hand sites and I noticed that volvos aren't rust proof, but faired very well for 10-15 year old cars , given the conditions they've been driven in.
some cars had a bit of rust between the windshield and the roof and tiny amounts on some of the fenders
overall most were pretty spotless in terms of corrosion
Municipal government official here. I'm a Selectman on a board of five in a small town in Northern New England. One of the things we have authority over is what our highway department does.
Redpill me on why we should sand instead of salt and I'll make a case for it before the other board members and put forward a motion.
Background: >winding roads >dirt roads >rolling terrain >lots of rain and flooding >lots of wintry mix days and high average snowfall >multi week cold snaps of 0f >frequent freak thaws >highway dept is our biggest line item >very on top of our plowing and salting >very active road maintenance and storm water managent >high percentage of drivers are ski vacationers
salt makes roads wet
winter tires tend to aquaplane hard, they are designed to shovel snow and either mamximize contact patch or stud into ice depending on studdiness, not to evacuate lots of water fast like summer tires
sand makes whatever current surface is more grippy, less grippy than wet asphalt but the grip is predictable and the speeds are lower because drivers don't percieve the road as clear
also sand doesn't poison the frogs when spring comes
Salting while plowing reduces the amount of plow runs and man hours required to return to bare pavement. Salt over sand also reduces the extent of our spring clean up operations. The sand causes drainage issues and builds up around roads and in water management systems like culverts.
Meanwhile your multi million dollar replacement bridges aren't falling apart as fast and everyone's cars are lasting longer too. Throwing down salt is the epitome of short sighted and laziness costing you more decades down the road.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>government is corrupt and ineffective as usual >it's all because of the damn salt!
Maybe if you didn't drink so much road runnoff you'd be less salty.
2 years ago
Anonymous
>This is a bad idea! >Doesn't matter gov't is corrupt so why do anything.
Do you not take responsibility for anything?
2 years ago
Anonymous
Yeah sure thing. I take personal reponsibility for whatever you irrationally hate about the government. That makes about as much sense as blaming chlorides as a priority for soil poison.
2 years ago
Anonymous
building more bridges is +gdp
building more cars is +gdp
salt industry is +gdp
gdp is good
frick sand, sand doesn't raise gdp
2 years ago
Anonymous
That means hiring another person.
2 years ago
Anonymous
Hmm paying a few guys 40k a year or less to plow, or paying A million every 10-15 years to rehabilitate or replace 1 bridge.
2 years ago
Anonymous
I told you, it's a small town. We don't have any multimillion dollar bridges.
Corrosion makes cars less safe in an accident. Dunno if you have inspections but you could make the point that less people will drive around in rotten deathtraps. Might also be cheaper, but I can't be bothered to look into it.
Salt is bad for the environment. All of the roadside rodents and birbs have high blood pressure cause of you jerks. Sand is environmentally friendly and tends to work better.
Salt is bad for local wildlife and permanently pollutes nearby bodies of water with chloride. In Minnesota the number one water pollutant is road salt. Salt is bad for cars and other machinery, they become structurally unsound very rapidly due to the fact that it acts as an electrolyte. When salted roads dry up temporarily in the winter, the lines and marking on the roads are difficult to see because the road is stained white.
Use sand, protect the watertable. Sand can be obtained from breaking down recycled glass, which could pose a local recycling opportunity.
They used to use salt on this hill my parents grew up on, and to be honest the resulting salt burms weren't really that bad except for the people at the bottom who had to shovel them out like they had to do with the snow anyway.
But the stopped using the sand I don't know how long ago and it really wasn't much worse except nobody had to deal with mudslides and sand burms anymore. I can't imagine what it would be like if they poured beet juice down the hill except for pissing off the corn lobby.
Our equipment currently doesn't use any kind of liquid broadcasting technology. It's an extremely large hopper with spreader for dry materials, not currently equipped for any kind of liquids. Is beet juice still a possibility? Do they make pellets or anything?
I've heard of beet juice combined with salt, but idk how well that would work with your city's setup.
You could also rent sprayer equipment from local farmers during the winter, or contract asphalt/resurfacing companies for their oil sprayers
2 years ago
Anonymous
My feeling is that the boomer caucus (everyone except me) will lose their minds at the idea and so I need a low or no cost (compared to salt) way of proposing changes incrementally in order to make any kind of meaningful headway. It's hard enough to get any new business introduced without the chair trying to shut me up so he can adjourn the meeting as quickly as possible.
VAG from 2000 to 2006 had superb corrosion protection. I used tp have a polo as a winter beater for 10 years, drove it over salted roads every day and parked it outside, and when I sold it that thing had absolutely 0 body rust. took a look inside the rocker panels because apparently those were a weakness and they looked totally fresh.
No. Because satisfying a need for only ~75 million amerifats who salt their roads and less than 10% of those vehicles even lasting long enough to have a problem isn't financially worth it for automakers.
Audi started to galvanize the car bodies in the 80‘s
Theres plenty of B8 Audis with rusting issues from trunklid, wheel wells.
And the quality of heir galvanization dropped drastically with the B5 because of environmental regulations.
Porsche galvanized theirs in the 1980s, too. Even when you see clapped out shells that've been open to the elements for months in junkyards, you still don't see any corrosion on their chassis. I don't know if they ever stopped or cheaped out on it later on, though.
opel g astras are also still in good shape because of that.
Nah, Opel has nothing to do with VAG and those rusted pretty bad.
t. previous owner of an Astra.
>No.
That's why you need to take it into your own hands if your car even has the chance of seeing salt.
Not fricking nissan i'll tell you that much right now
Aluminum body ferd truggs. Japanese cars. That's it.
>japan
>no rust cars
lol
>Japanese cars
>cars
eudm is actually good for rust on toyota and honda
toyota even offers a ten year guarantee for rust
The pic I posted was a mexican trying to sell a tacoma. I daily a 97 4runner in salt country with zero rust issues because I keep an eye on it.
How do you control it?
Fluid film everything every year and spray the underside off at least once a week all winter. I go to a self serve car wash and just assume I'm going to get frostbite while I clean off every nook. It also helped that the truck was boomer owned and garage kept before I got it.
suzuki has 12
>ten year guarantee for rust
That doesn't actually mean shit unless you get it inspected early in the stealership. Toyotas from the 00s onward seem to be holding up the best though.
*yearly
>Toyotas from the 00s onward seem to be holding up the best though.
Trucks with unibody construction have to beware of rust the most. Or else if they get on a lift, their weakened unibody welds and spot welds break free in the bed area if the vehicle is lifted.
Don't really get a lot of those in Europe. We had the Auris, Avensis and other derivations of those instead.
That's just the result of Finite Element Analysis. Only put the material where it's needed!
Haha...dude this was a tacoma in a facebook post and the beaner selling it basically said that "it still runs fine" and that he's been driving it for years like that. Sometimes a smartass shitpost is actually what people think
now lets look at american cars then
That's a Japanese brand truck made in the U.S.
>japanese cars
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
Yes. Subarus, Toyotas and Hondas all rust out less then their us equivalents. 2010s American cars all have body rot while the Japanese brands don't. Same thing with trucks. Last gen Tundras don't have the massive body rot any the big 3 steel body trucks have
lmao. you have a lot to learn young zoom zoom
>zoom zoom
I think that's the sound of rust.
my 82 golf has like 1/4" thick rubber coating in every wheel well and on most of the undercarriage from the factory. I don't know if any new brands give a shit though.
doesn't a coating like this trap in moisture?
it can't trap in moisture if no moisture gets in.
I had the same kind of coating on my Alfa 156. Had to scrap it because the floorpan was entirely rubber.
all coatings find a way of failing eventually, what i've found with factory rubberised coatings is their effectiveness is linked to how well adhered they are to the underlaying surface, on the early golfs it seems to be stuck on pretty well so if rust does start to creep under it, it's a slow process, on a BMW i had with a similar type of undercoating it seemed to accelerate the rusting process due to poor adhesion, so surface preparation at the factory would appear to be a critical aspect of how well these types of coatings work
That's nice until it starts to trap moisture inside. And then you have to spend hours using a scalpel to remove the coating.
That's what happened to my 72 Beetle.
guess I'm lucky to not live in a shitty rustbelt state. I guess it makes the coating kind of useless anyway though since my car wouldn't rust out without it anyway.
No why would you ever give a shit when the customers you want just buy a new car every 5 years?
This doesn't happen if you coat both sides.
Remove all moisture and iron oxide from inside cavities. Coat inside of cavity.
>Remove all moisture and iron oxide from inside cavities. Coat inside of cavity
But how do you do it? Or do you periodically take it to a shop.
Has to be done during manufacturing process or holes have to be drilled in cavities and then coating sprayed in.
How the hell else would you coat a cavity?
I coated your moms cavity
>Remove all iron oxide from inside cavities
yeah good luck with that
The moisture trapping happens because the coating dries up and starts cracking so water can get through the cracks.
I've looked into it and basically if you would want to protect the underside you would have to clean all the rust spots to bare metal, paint it with anti-corrosion primer, base coat (optional), spray on an anti-gravel layer and use special wax on top of that so it doesnt crack and suck up moisture. Additionally you also have to spray a special wax inside all the closed off spaces in the framework so they dont start rusting from the inside.
It's a lot of work but the car will probably be pristine for a long time after that.
50 years is not a bad record tho
beetles were horrible for rust, terminal corrosion at 10 years old if you live someplace where it rains
Not anymore, audi went heavy on galvanized steel back in the 90s, Volvo too in the 90s albeit they didn't manage to do it as well.
80s Vulva > 90s and Ferd era Vulva
Just do not scratch your car, simple as. If there is paint over metal it can't rust
Based moron.
rust starts inside box sections & seams, cars mostly rust from the inside out
I saw this unusually-shaped but obviously somewhat recent bmw in the parking lot the other days with all tint and rims and the rest. And the rear quarter panels look like somebody grabbed them off of a 90s subaru. I've never particularly associated bmws with hideous rust problems.
>his body panels can rust
>implying the rest of the car isn't prone to rust
lol, lmao even
Well duh but not having to worry about the doors or rockers is still nice. That's usually where rust hits first.
True. Though I still consider rusting on crucial suspension and structural components worse than no rust on rockers and doors.
>his body panels can melt
To be fair, that looks like it was exposed to actual open flame. All bets are off at that point.
That's the paint doing that. Those don't even have plastic doors. You had one job to do and you failed.
Except the first gens did you fricking moron. You're even dumber for thinking paint would slide off in a sheet and take on the shape of deformed plastic. You had one job to do and you were too fricking dumb to do it.
https://www.nytimes.com/2002/07/28/automobiles/behind-wheel-saturn-vue-small-plastic-sided-slice-old-general-motors.html
I want one so bad bros. What do I do.
Hit up your local bingo hall and sweet talk a grandma.
if they built things to last, then they wouldn't sell as many cars
Not really. Commercial trucks are generally built to last but even my 2020 5 ton Freightshaker work truck is caked in rust.
I'm on my second Corvette and have had zero body rust.
More like you need to hold your local gov'ts accountable for dumping salt on the roads when it does frick all in a lot of cases.
Theres only so much car manufacturers can do with galvanization, and other rustproofing shit.
When the government owns the car in the first place, it's kind of hard to have any legal standing for them ruining their own property.
Aren't most Euros good wirh rust and Asians bad?
I'd say it definitely depends. A lot of Euro cars rust. Either through bad design, bad rust protection or just bad luck. In my case nearly all 3. The Saab 9-5 rusts at the arches where the metal meets the plastic bumper as you can see. I've got some friends with older BMWs/Mercs and it's the same shit. Rust every where, albeit hidden.
French cars have generally had good rust protection since the 90s
>all that rot in just one place despite the paint looking new
why did they pour acid on it
nah its the opposite, water collects on the lip of the inside of the hood when it rains and sits there for a long time, causing rust to eventually make its way through the metal
i drive a 2006 matrix with a 5 speed manual. one day i took it to get the lower control arm replaced and the mechanic asked me if the car gets driven to the beach often because the car bottom was very rusted. yeah, i might have driven it a few times to the beach.
over 200,000 miles on it and the thing is still driving.
Texan here.
What's that reddish brown stuff?
Volvo, maybe.
had 2 Mazdas - 323f (2003), 3 (2004)
both melted like aspirin in the rain
got a Volvo (S80 - 2005) in hope i don't ever have to deal with rust and because they're cool.
in my research, I browsed swedish second hand sites and I noticed that volvos aren't rust proof, but faired very well for 10-15 year old cars , given the conditions they've been driven in.
some cars had a bit of rust between the windshield and the roof and tiny amounts on some of the fenders
overall most were pretty spotless in terms of corrosion
Municipal government official here. I'm a Selectman on a board of five in a small town in Northern New England. One of the things we have authority over is what our highway department does.
Redpill me on why we should sand instead of salt and I'll make a case for it before the other board members and put forward a motion.
Background:
>winding roads
>dirt roads
>rolling terrain
>lots of rain and flooding
>lots of wintry mix days and high average snowfall
>multi week cold snaps of 0f
>frequent freak thaws
>highway dept is our biggest line item
>very on top of our plowing and salting
>very active road maintenance and storm water managent
>high percentage of drivers are ski vacationers
salt makes roads wet
winter tires tend to aquaplane hard, they are designed to shovel snow and either mamximize contact patch or stud into ice depending on studdiness, not to evacuate lots of water fast like summer tires
sand makes whatever current surface is more grippy, less grippy than wet asphalt but the grip is predictable and the speeds are lower because drivers don't percieve the road as clear
also sand doesn't poison the frogs when spring comes
>I'm literally incapable of picking the right tire for road conditions
>please daddy government save me
you deserve the ditch
All the flavors available and you chose salt.
Salting while plowing reduces the amount of plow runs and man hours required to return to bare pavement. Salt over sand also reduces the extent of our spring clean up operations. The sand causes drainage issues and builds up around roads and in water management systems like culverts.
>oh no I have to do a few extra plow runs.
Meanwhile your multi million dollar replacement bridges aren't falling apart as fast and everyone's cars are lasting longer too. Throwing down salt is the epitome of short sighted and laziness costing you more decades down the road.
>government is corrupt and ineffective as usual
>it's all because of the damn salt!
Maybe if you didn't drink so much road runnoff you'd be less salty.
>This is a bad idea!
>Doesn't matter gov't is corrupt so why do anything.
Do you not take responsibility for anything?
Yeah sure thing. I take personal reponsibility for whatever you irrationally hate about the government. That makes about as much sense as blaming chlorides as a priority for soil poison.
building more bridges is +gdp
building more cars is +gdp
salt industry is +gdp
gdp is good
frick sand, sand doesn't raise gdp
That means hiring another person.
Hmm paying a few guys 40k a year or less to plow, or paying A million every 10-15 years to rehabilitate or replace 1 bridge.
I told you, it's a small town. We don't have any multimillion dollar bridges.
Corrosion makes cars less safe in an accident. Dunno if you have inspections but you could make the point that less people will drive around in rotten deathtraps. Might also be cheaper, but I can't be bothered to look into it.
Beet juice m8
Salt is bad for the environment. All of the roadside rodents and birbs have high blood pressure cause of you jerks. Sand is environmentally friendly and tends to work better.
>All of the roadside rodents and birbs have high blood pressure cause of you jerks.
lmao
Salt is bad for local wildlife and permanently pollutes nearby bodies of water with chloride. In Minnesota the number one water pollutant is road salt. Salt is bad for cars and other machinery, they become structurally unsound very rapidly due to the fact that it acts as an electrolyte. When salted roads dry up temporarily in the winter, the lines and marking on the roads are difficult to see because the road is stained white.
Use sand, protect the watertable. Sand can be obtained from breaking down recycled glass, which could pose a local recycling opportunity.
You want to use Beet Juice combined with Sand instead of salt
They used to use salt on this hill my parents grew up on, and to be honest the resulting salt burms weren't really that bad except for the people at the bottom who had to shovel them out like they had to do with the snow anyway.
But the stopped using the sand I don't know how long ago and it really wasn't much worse except nobody had to deal with mudslides and sand burms anymore. I can't imagine what it would be like if they poured beet juice down the hill except for pissing off the corn lobby.
Our equipment currently doesn't use any kind of liquid broadcasting technology. It's an extremely large hopper with spreader for dry materials, not currently equipped for any kind of liquids. Is beet juice still a possibility? Do they make pellets or anything?
I've heard of beet juice combined with salt, but idk how well that would work with your city's setup.
You could also rent sprayer equipment from local farmers during the winter, or contract asphalt/resurfacing companies for their oil sprayers
My feeling is that the boomer caucus (everyone except me) will lose their minds at the idea and so I need a low or no cost (compared to salt) way of proposing changes incrementally in order to make any kind of meaningful headway. It's hard enough to get any new business introduced without the chair trying to shut me up so he can adjourn the meeting as quickly as possible.
Aluminium Audis of 90s-00s
Protest against the use of salt, they are alternatives available.
VAG from 2000 to 2006 had superb corrosion protection. I used tp have a polo as a winter beater for 10 years, drove it over salted roads every day and parked it outside, and when I sold it that thing had absolutely 0 body rust. took a look inside the rocker panels because apparently those were a weakness and they looked totally fresh.
Definitely nothing built by the Japs, ever.
No. Because satisfying a need for only ~75 million amerifats who salt their roads and less than 10% of those vehicles even lasting long enough to have a problem isn't financially worth it for automakers.
Volkswagen Group and other german automakers.
yes, Ineos
Jaguar started using galvanized steel in the 1990s